The Big Interview: William Lees-Jones, JW Lees

He’s a man, and he’s partial to a pastry-based meat product, so when, one Friday early doors, William Lees-Jones and his drinking pals were served free pies at their local, the Rising Sun in Tarporley, Cheshire, it was a revelation.

In fact, he liked it so much he nicked the idea. Walk into any of the 36 managed houses in the JW Lees estate at the end of the working week and you’ll find free food on the bar.

“It gets men into the pub early doors,” explains Lees-Jones. “Our managers decide exactly what to put on, but it’s good, proper food.

“People ask me where the budget comes from, but they don’t ask those kinds of questions if you offer a discount. You don’t need a budget if it makes you money, and in one pub it’s added £1,000 to the week’s turnover.”

Bold thinking​

It’s a small example of the bold thinking that’s transformed the north Manchester brewer since 2004, when Lees-Jones took over as managing director of his family firm.

It hasn’t all been change that’s nice for some to hear. In that time he’s closed 51 pubs, most of them traditional tenanted houses around the Victorian brewery in Middleton, Greater Manchester. Most have been replaced by food-led pubs further afield, and managed houses have become more important in the mix.

He has also disposed of non-core activities such as two pubs in France and a wine merchants up in the Lake District.

“It’s beer, food and hospitality that’s driving the business now,” he says, and they’re driving it rather well. “According to our calculations, we’re the seventh most profitable regional brewery in the UK.

“Buying 10 sites from Punch in 2009 was a big catalyst for us. They are good pubs that perform well. We’ve gone from being on the back foot to being on the front foot, and that brings opportunities.

“Because we’re making good profits it means the bank is willing to lend us more money, so we’re looking to accelerate growth.

“We’re sitting on £20m and can get another £10m from the bank. And to me that money means pubs — new-builds, conversions and — especially — buying pubs in places where we’re not well known.

Traditional​

“We have 164 pubs now and we want to get to 200,” he goes on. “Twenty years ago we had 172. But this time they’ll be very high-quality pubs. There are opportunities to buy pubs off the larger pubcos, which we’ll spend £400,000 to £500,000 doing up.

“How many pubs you have is an irrelevant question really, though,” he adds.

“We have a new rule that says a managed house has to take at least £1m a year. We’ve got a bar for tenancies, too, but as we’re still in transition I’d rather not say what it is.”

In spite of these changes, Lees-Jones insists that JW Lees remains “totally traditional”. “In fact, we’ve become a much stronger business by making the most of the positives of being traditional.”

Underlying that, of course, is JW Lees’ survival as an independent family business. Yet the young Lees-Jones didn’t see himself working alongside his father and uncle at the brewery. His first passion was the glitzy world of the ad industry.

“I found advertising fascinating,” he says. “In the 1980s everything was booming and I had no thought of working for the family business. There’s a rule here that no family member can join until at least five years after they’ve completed their education, but it would have been defeatist of me to do that anyway. I wanted to make my own way.

“It took me years to work out this would be a good place to work. To adapt the JFK quote, it came down to ‘ask not what the family business can do for you, but what you can do for the family business’.

“There are 1,100 people here whose wages have to be paid, and it’s them, rather than shareholders, that’s the primary driver for me.”

Experience​

Lees-Jones is joined in that responsibility by two siblings and two cousins.“But I was the only one who wanted to be MD,” he admits.

He’s also drafted in carefully selected experience from outside the family, most recently Kieran Rabbitt, ex-Stonegate, Punch and Mitchells & Butlers, as operations director.

“After 10 years I’ve worked out what I’m good at and got the team right,” he says, betraying the kind of patience you seem to need as a family brewer.

Lees-Jones’ approach is one that combines radical change with knowing when to stick to tradition. He’s “100%” in favour of the tie, believing it’s key to maintaining standards, and the JW Lees beer portfolio has certainly expanded in recent years, the most high-profile additions being the Governor, a joint effort with celebrity chef Marco Pierre White, and the latest launch, Manchester Pale Ale.

“But we’re not going to sell lots of craft beers because you can find them somewhere else. I don’t like pubs that sell everything and stand for nothing. It’s a real mistake. Customers need to know what they’re going to get.”

He’s pleased, too, that “we’ve not been tempted to outsource distribution. We’ve leased a new fleet of trucks, but you can’t outsource dray crews and technical services. They give a great service to our licensees, and it’s important we continue to do that.

“Our drivers see the customer every week, while I probably get to see them only once a year. They’re the touch-points that differentiate us.”

Panic​

Lees-Jones hasn’t hesitated, though, in closing pubs that are not performing.

“Saving pubs is wrong. A small single-income pub appealing to a male, heavy-drinking audience is very hard to sustain. If it fails you have a licensee and a family who don’t have anywhere to live, and if you keep the pub going and that happens to the next tenant, you have to ask what’s wrong.

“The acceleration of pub closures after the smoking ban is completely normal. People used to smoke a lot in our pubs. When the ban came in the strategy was to panic like hell and make jumbrella manufacturers rich. Then came the duty escalator and suddenly the smokers just disappeared from pubs and stayed at home. It changed everything for JW Lees.

“I’d worry if somebody else makes one of our failed pubs work. If it’s possible to get it right, we should be the ones doing it. But they close because there’s no future in them.”

Excellence​

He feels positive, though, about prospects for the industry, and hails family pub-restaurants’ growth.

“You shouldn’t just count the number of pubs, you should look at the total square footage. There’s more of that than there was 20 years ago because there are fewer smaller pubs. A Wetherspoon will do the business of eight small tenancies. That’s exactly what happened in Middleton. I wouldn’t want to have a pub opposite a Wetherspoon’s. It’s a phenomenal operator.

“We’ve got better as an industry,” he believes. “Pubs have got better at food, and we excel at hospitality. It’s in hospitality standards where we can deliver excellence.

“There will still be community pubs, but it won’t be for sentimental reasons. We’ve got to do what customers want for the future.”